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Hi all, been pretty much stuck in the same situation for ages now, gained about three kilos and sitting in the same spot, banded almost three years and still nowhere near where I wanted to be now. But anyway, one question. Grains, are they something one needs to avoid to lose weight? I was watching a bit of the biggest loser the other night and noticed the commando guy was dissing grains as bad for weight loss, what are your opinions

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I remember from year 12 health, that my teacher had said grains aren't always good as most of the time your body processes the grains as wholes and you don't get the nutrients from it and things like wholemeal is better.

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Hahaha commando .. 

Cows eat grains to get fat 

 

They help with fiber content as far as I'm concerned. If your worried maybe look at going palio diet .. some of the food looks amazing, it may or may not help as every body is different. 

 

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Abstract

There is growing awareness that the profound changes in the environment (eg, in diet and other lifestyle conditions) that began with the introduction of agriculture and animal husbandry ≈10000 y ago occurred too recently on an evolutionary time scale for the human genome to adjust. In conjunction with this discordance between our ancient, genetically determined biology and the nutritional, cultural, and activity patterns of contemporary Western populations, many of the so-called diseases of civilization have emerged. In particular, food staples and food-processing procedures introduced during the Neolithic and Industrial Periods have fundamentally altered 7 crucial nutritional characteristics of ancestral hominin diets: 1) glycemic load, 2) fatty acid composition, 3) macronutrient composition, 4) micronutrient density, 5) acid-base balance, 6) sodium-potassium ratio, and 7) fiber content. The evolutionary collision of our ancient genome with the nutritional qualities of recently introduced foods may underlie many of the chronic diseases of Western civilization.

Origins and evolution of the Western diet: health implications for the 21st century.  The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition®
Copyright © 2015 by the American Society for Nutrition 9650 Rockville Pike, Bethesda, MD 20814

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So overall we should probably go back to a paleontologist way and dismiss grains from our diet,  

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@round2baby, rather than being a smartarse to @denzel and attacking her for cut'n'pasting, which incidentally, she referenced and didn't break any copyright laws, perhaps you could have taken the time to read the article yourself.

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Youhave just cut and copied an article that has got a copy right. 

Onto a forum, 

In your own words was what I was asking,  not just a cut and copy. 

You could of said that there has been research done and the human body has not adapted to the grains that we have in our current diet and that could account for some of the disease and illnesses we have now in society.

 

So overall we should probably go back to a paleontologist way and dismiss grains fromo our diet,  

round2baby, I found what you have posted offensive, bullying and abusive.

This is exactly what you requested: "No offense but I don't have time to read that article, as you have read it can you just give me the highlights ? "

 I have neurocognitive problems (acquired brain injury)  and a lot of the time have problems articulating the right words, comprehending stuff, and other cognitive problems.

Having 2 Bachelor degrees in Science, + other qualifications in health , I am one of those people who like to see research.  I used to have (before I got sick 17 years ago) the ability to review an article in a journal and critique it.

And there are a lot of other folk out there who would prefer to read scientific articles which have been peer reviewed, than just someone's opinion.

So, by taking the time and effort out of my extremely limited health and energy budget, as doing this response has, I provided exactly what you asked  -    "No offense but I don't have time to read that article, as you have read it can you just give me the highlights ? " Nowhere did you ask me to provide a synopsis in my own words.

An abstract.

And this is a definition of an abstract:

1.
a summary of the contents of a book, article, or speech.
"an abstract of her speech"

Please provide evidence, not just opinion, that  I broke copyright laws.

 

I recently contacted the authors of "Real Meal Revolution" concerning a glaring (to me, but that was an area I had experience in) scientific/biological mistake they made (not related to their diet for humans).  BTW, that is a great book. And even more interesting reading on going grain free.

Edited by denzel
responding to abuse
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I am just trying to keep it simple personally. I have not cut anything out and as per nutritionist advice, trying to stick to the right volumes of each of the food groups, of which includes grains. I don't believe in the paleo fad, and I think people forget we have evolved over a long period of time and what real impact would it have forcing our bodies back to a pre-evolved state? Anyway, all I know is by exercising and eating a balanced diet including all food groups and heavily decreased amount of processed foods, I continue to lose weight and that's good enough science for me :)

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I only asked because I like to eat porridge most mornings and wondered if that played a part in my slow progress, I seem to be able to eat that in the morning and thats about all. most lunch times I cant eat much, I often chuck up these days even soft poached eat for lunch. I have never quite got it right with my band. yesterday all I had was a bowl of porridge and a cup of soup and a few coffees, lunch would not stay down, tea was thrown out. I have no idea what was causing my band to be so tight.  I also have days when i can eat most things but I dont eat bread or anything doughy like scones. i hate going out to eat and some days I'm only on sliders, on the days I can eat I sometimes go overboard. I have less than 2mil in a 10 mil band. I'm due to travel back to the city to see me my doc in December.  Today seems a good day with my band, things are going down OK and I'm on track. This band is actually hard work but if I  could have a sleeve or bypass id jump at it. Being a public patient its unlikely Id get that so regardless of how annoying the band is I wont have it out because I know i will regain weight

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I don't agree with eliminating grains completely from the diet, I disagree with the opinion of the 'paleo promoters' that our ancestors didn't eat them and neither should we (I know, I'm over-simplifying here and making gross generalisations).

I believe that if our ancestors had access to the types of grains we have today, they would have eaten them simply because of the energy gained. What might have happened to the human race in the last 10,000 years if that happened is anyone's guess, of course.

I support the view that some grains (such as wholegrains and steel cut oats, for example) are of benefit to us. They provide sustained release energy and provide a good source of fibre, vitamins and minerals. Should we eat as much as we as a society actually do? NO. Should we eat some? I believe so. I eat grains - quinoa, rice, vitawheat crackers, 5 seed gluten free bread, etc.

At the end of the day, if your body tolerates them well and you enjoy them, then continue to eat them. It's all part of a balanced diet.

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Anyway, this is just my experience.  I went low-carb in 2002 to lose weight (which I did, went from 82.5 kg to 57 kg).  And going low-carb, not intentionally,  included going gluten-free etc.  I found that my 'brain-fog', general unwellness and sluggishness cleared up immensely.  When I have a 'carb party' involving grains, after I feel horrendous.

I do eat seeds (pumpkin, sesame, poppy, chia, amaranth, flax, pine etc), nuts, legumes and pulses, and have occasional quinoa.

Also eat low GI veg and fruit.

I avoid potato, cornflour, maize flour, rice, rice flour etc as these are just "empty" carbs, ie have no nutritional benefit.  I want nutritional "bang for my buck" for the limited amount of food that I do eat.

I have a friend who when she doesn't have gluten finds that her overall body-stiffness improves.

A lot of people, including myself, are not coeliac, but are gluten-intolerant.

I am still low-carb, and feel great following that way of eating (WOE).

2nd Feb this year, the day of my surgery, I was at 42.5% body fat, now I am somewhere around 18%.

All the best,

:)

Edited by denzel
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I'm also a big fan of low carb .... doesn't mean I always follow it ... lol. Just as an example, in the last 2 weeks I've been really relaxed with carbs [read: kamikaze rollercoaster carb party on and off for 2 weeks ... which I am reigning in] and I've put on 2.3kg. My body just doesn't do carbs. 

Re. the oats/porridge ... I eat oats, sometimes every day if I'm on an oat bender but even though oats are carby, they're good carby and they have beta glucans. You might need to look at the portion size and/or what you're having with your oats. I have 1/4 cup of oats made up with 3/4 cup of oat and/or Vitasoy unsweetened coconut milk. Then I usually mix in half a banana and a sprinkle of walnuts, or a tbs of peanut butter with a couple of dates, or a tablespoon of tahini, a tbs of chocolate protein powder, a couple of dates and a little sprinkle of salt, or I make them up with a little stock or curry powder and top them with a poached egg.

You've gotta pick your carbs. Sugar and flour carbs for me are like poison. I also, for the most part, avoid rice, pasta and potatoes. But the good carbs, like those found in fruit and non-starchy veges, nuts and seeds, work well for me. Veges are like free calories for me, and also fruit to a degree.

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My opinion on this is carb loaded foods (with or without grains) makes me sluggish and tired. It used to elevate my blood sugar. Since my WLS in April 2014 and removing bread and most carb foods and starchy veg like corn and potato my body has thanked me for it. In regards to my band, I find when I have gotten adventurous and had a slice of toast with grain in it, it has been a challenge for my lap band. White bread is ok, wholemeal is ok, but grains nope. I also had severe gastrointestinal issues prior to my surgery with a history of SIBO which I still have and I can now directly attribute it to heavy carb loads and grains. Resulting in days of excessive trips to the toilet, sleepiness, exhaustion after doing nadda and "brain fog". I too have been tested for Coeliacs and Crohn's Disease which I do not have. 

Every body is different and every reaction is different. WLS not only saved my life and rid me of T2 Diabetes but it taught me the nastiness of carbs and grains on MY tummy. Knowledge truly IS power but making the time to educate yourself on such things and how it relates to YOU  is important as no one knows your body better than you. Good luck :D 

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I agree Denzel, if I have a 'carb-rich' diet, I don't feel as satisfied or as good than when I have a protein rich, low carb diet. I find that I tend to pick and graze and I also feel sluggish and BLAH.

I do have a diagnosed wheat and gluten intolerance and allergy so I avoid these wherever possible (although sometimes I lose my shit and indulge, then wonder why I feel BLAH, bloated, sluggish and my dermatitis flares up). I find that I tend to do better overall if I make protein my priority, then veges, then fruit then carbs (when I say carbs, I mean pasta, bread, rice, etc). But that is my personal preference and what works for me.

Now...to follow my own advice!

 

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I do have a diagnosed wheat and gluten intolerance and allergy so I avoid these wherever possible

I believe that there is a lot of people out there with undiagnosed gluten sensitivity/intolerance, and also undiagnosed coeliac disease.

Interestingly, my sister's autoimmune markers for rheumatoid arthritis dropped when she went gluten free. Mine are normal, but then I have basically been gluten-free for so long that could have an impact.  I have persistent significant ANA levels, with speckled patterns and another I can't remember.

I've got a book somewhere (packed now for the move, when it comes lol!) with a diagram of gluten sensitivity/intolerance with it looking like an iceberg.

There are some interesting diagrams here:  https://www.google.com.au/search?q=coeliac+disease+iceberg&rlz=1T4PCTC_enAU383AU383&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAWoVChMIjJmF_fWzyAIVQymmCh1puAuD&biw=1168&bih=565

Anyway, regardless, grains are not necessary to the human diet.  All the nutrients in them can come from other products.  And getting back to carbs - out bodies don't need carbs because we can manufacture glucose through a process called glucogeneogenesis from fats and protein.  Fats and protein are essential macronutrients.

Edited by denzel

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I haven't stopped eating carbs, although I don't eat all that many of them but I stopped eating added sugar and that's when my weight loss started again - even being pregnant! During this pregnancy, I have eaten pasta, raisin toast, corn and potato fairly regularly, as well as some rice - still more than 10kg down! Although, I did find the week I went crazy on croissants, I put weight on. So for my body, apparently it's the sugar I can't metabolise.

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